Next coaching candidates

Sheriff Coffee said:
I’ve read that almost every good college coach is a Sexton client. I never thought about the Nike/Addidas (potential) influence. Either way, Kraft’s career is on the line. I hope he didn’t bite off more than he can chew.
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Ok, but if I am a coach , my agent works for me. If I want a particular job, my agent better do his best to get me that job or I look for a new agent. So apparently the PSU job is not seen as a great job. If that’s the case, give the job to Terry now and see what he can do. Hire a GM and get going on the portal.
 
Jerry said:
I don't think you're in a position to declare what Terry thinks or "knows." After the big Nebraska win, Terry's comments left no doubt that he's more than interested in the job.

It seems clear that Terry has a lot of support from the players and staff. Would he have been my first choice after Franklin got fired? No. But as the weeks have gone by and the team has won three games in a row under Terry's leadership while one big name after another has dropped off the list...to the point where we're now dressing up Sitake as a potential high-price home-run hire even though he has no football ties to the region and was on nobody's radar as recently as a week ago...I think a case can be made for settling on Terry to stop the bleeding and giving him a shot.

I don't think I'm freaking out. I think I'm appraising the situation realistically.

All this said, regardless of who finally gets the nod, I'll support the choice and give the guy a chance. We're looking at an uphill climb and program rebuild at this point. Next year's schedule sets up very well, which should be a big help. But we shouldn't kid ourselves about the challenges facing the new coach.
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1) You had said that you didn't watch the Rutgers game. Terry showed very little emotion. He already knows that he isn't the guy. He has to know that in spite of being an awesome PSU guy and an asset to the program that he simply doesn't have the experience to take the leap. If you disagree with this, list all of the position coaches at top power 4 schools without even coordinator experience in the history of the sport who have made the leap to being a head coach at a top power 4 school. You will not have a list. This just doesn't happen in big time programs.

2) Sitake wins and is a high character guy. If you can get BYU to finish 11-2 and #13 in the country and then follow it up with 11-1 and currently #11 in the country, then you can flat out coach. BYU doesn't have even half of the resources of a PSU. I'm not saying he's the guy but he is clearly qualified to run a top program.

3) The quote from you below and your insistence all viable candidates have turned PSU down is what gives me the impression that you are hyperventilating. That's why I said that you need to take a breath.

"We're looking at an imploded program, a fired coach, a team thought to be a legitimate potential national champion limping to a 6-6 record, horrendous upset losses to inferior teams, and all in all the most disastrous season in Penn State history..and Mary talks about "silver linings." Please."

4) We are not privy to the full list of candidates nor where they stand on our list. It could very well be the case that the top candidate is locked up but finishing up his current season with his team. Not everyone abandons their employer, their players, and the fans when they have a better opportunity in the middle of something special like Kiffin. I don't like not knowing right now either but that doesn't mean we haven't locked up our guy or there aren't strong options that we haven't even discussed.

5) Agreed. We want what is best for PSU. Whomever is named head coach, we get behind (except maybe Hartline, he's a 2X DUI bad example for young men).
 
Frank Lee said:
The theme from my posts is why the complexity of the job when it can be simplified. Divisions of labor like what happens when any organization grows. Let Terry do what he does best. As far as Xs & Os and on field performance, execute like Kaytron Allen running off tackle or Gronk hitting Rappleyea in stride. If Franklin learned it to a degree and failed at some aspects of it, then most coordinators and position coaches who've witnessed years of great players, playcalling, and even the dumbsh!t stuff, and particularly those with thicker skin than Franklin, could get a knack for head coaching after three games, much like Terry Smith did.
And a lot of us could be viable candidates with a few years of apprenticing as GAs, position coaches, and coordinators. It would allow for learning the processes and nuances, but we all know how the game works. Kenny Dillingham, for example, never played college ball.
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I agree with a lot of what you say, this is a billion+ dollar operation. But where we disagree is that the head coach oversees all of these divisions of labor. Sure, they have a Chief of Staff, a Head of Operations, etc. But they need the experience to make sure that these are all working effectively and seamlessly.

Terry doesn't have that experience. He probably doesn't even have exposure to many of the roles because he played a role too low on the ladder that it wasn't in his purview to have an oversight of them. We aren't a program that needs a head coach in training. We need a head coach. Preferably one that doesn't fold when we get our first loss. Franklin was a great face of the program and seemed to approach it as a CEO. That's good but you can't be soft. You can't clench your cheeks every time you play a top 5 team. You can't need a few weeks to recover from a loss. We need a little of Terry's toughness and emotion while having someone who already has the commensurate experience that the job requires.
 
jjw165 said:
How did Ryan Day pull off the head coaching role at OSU when he was never a head coach prior? He became the interim for a year after UM retired. Then became the permanent HC after that trial period. Now, he did have a few years of coordinator experience, something Terry doesn’t have yet. But, OSU is a preeminent college football program today winning a national championship last season and currently in the driver’s seat this year. There’s something to be said about hiring candidates that have shared values and alignment with the organization.
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1) As you stated, he had been a coordinator prior to this in that organization.
2) Also, everyone else in that organization stayed in place except UM. And they already had more 5 stars on their roster than all other Big 10 teams combined. That kind of makes it easier to win.
 
LudicrousSpeedGO! said:
I agree with a lot of what you say, this is a billion+ dollar operation. But where we disagree is that the head coach oversees all of these divisions of labor. Sure, they have a Chief of Staff, a Head of Operations, etc. But they need the experience to make sure that these are all working effectively and seamlessly.

Terry doesn't have that experience. He probably doesn't even have exposure to many of the roles because he played a role too low on the ladder that it wasn't in his purview to have an oversight of them. We aren't a program that needs a head coach in training. We need a head coach. Preferably one that doesn't fold when we get our first loss. Franklin was a great face of the program and seemed to approach it as a CEO. That's good but you can't be soft. You can't clench your cheeks every time you play a top 5 team. You can't need a few weeks to recover from a loss. We need a little of Terry's toughness and emotion while having someone who already has the commensurate experience that the job requires.
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"...the head coach oversees all of these divisions of labor. Sure, they have a Chief of Staff, a Head of Operations, etc. But they need the experience to make sure that these are all working effectively and seamlessly."

Org charts and responsibilities can be changed unless there's an NCAA regulation on it. Paradigm shift, out of the box thinking, etc. The head coach, especially if Terry, should be relieved of all responsibilities that don't pertain to assembling and training players, and winning football games. Maybe there should be a CEO who is independent but supportive of the SVP - Game Operations (aka Head Coach).
***
Henry Ford stuck to building simple cars using efficient processes. Years later, Michael Dell did the same thing but in a different industry. Many Ivy MBA CEOs with those aggressive CEO personalities want to know what their companies are doing in the cloud space, AI, data analytics, product financialization, leveraging balance sheets, IPOs, stock buy backs, etc. IMO, they should focus on building quality products and services that the market wants at the prices it's willing to pay. Moral of the story: K.I.S.S.
 
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LudicrousSpeedGO! said:
I agree with a lot of what you say, this is a billion+ dollar operation. But where we disagree is that the head coach oversees all of these divisions of labor. Sure, they have a Chief of Staff, a Head of Operations, etc. But they need the experience to make sure that these are all working effectively and seamlessly.

Terry doesn't have that experience. He probably doesn't even have exposure to many of the roles because he played a role too low on the ladder that it wasn't in his purview to have an oversight of them. We aren't a program that needs a head coach in training. We need a head coach. Preferably one that doesn't fold when we get our first loss. Franklin was a great face of the program and seemed to approach it as a CEO. That's good but you can't be soft. You can't clench your cheeks every time you play a top 5 team. You can't need a few weeks to recover from a loss. We need a little of Terry's toughness and emotion while having someone who already has the commensurate experience that the job requires.
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His title included ‘assistant head coach’ so you have no idea how much knowledge and experience he has at managing the empire.

He didn’t get that title for good looks. And he wasn’t given the title to keep him from leaving.

He got it because he earned it. And he had to get managerial experience with that title.
 
Finally a flight tracker has shown up it seems. I have no idea if this is real. I saw it on FB and flight tracking was all the rage the last time 🤣🤣
 

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LudicrousSpeedGO! said:
1) You had said that you didn't watch the Rutgers game. Terry showed very little emotion. He already knows that he isn't the guy. He has to know that in spite of being an awesome PSU guy and an asset to the program that he simply doesn't have the experience to take the leap. If you disagree with this, list all of the position coaches at top power 4 schools without even coordinator experience in the history of the sport who have made the leap to being a head coach at a top power 4 school. You will not have a list. This just doesn't happen in big time programs.

2) Sitake wins and is a high character guy. If you can get BYU to finish 11-2 and #13 in the country and then follow it up with 11-1 and currently #11 in the country, then you can flat out coach. BYU doesn't have even half of the resources of a PSU. I'm not saying he's the guy but he is clearly qualified to run a top program.

3) The quote from you below and your insistence all viable candidates have turned PSU down is what gives me the impression that you are hyperventilating. That's why I said that you need to take a breath.

"We're looking at an imploded program, a fired coach, a team thought to be a legitimate potential national champion limping to a 6-6 record, horrendous upset losses to inferior teams, and all in all the most disastrous season in Penn State history..and Mary talks about "silver linings." Please."

4) We are not privy to the full list of candidates nor where they stand on our list. It could very well be the case that the top candidate is locked up but finishing up his current season with his team. Not everyone abandons their employer, their players, and the fans when they have a better opportunity in the middle of something special like Kiffin. I don't like not knowing right now either but that doesn't mean we haven't locked up our guy or there aren't strong options that we haven't even discussed.

5) Agreed. We want what is best for PSU. Whomever is named head coach, we get behind (except maybe Hartline, he's a 2X DUI bad example for young men).
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1) I think you're selling Terry short. He's had very wide experience in the program which is why they gave him the title associate head coach several years ago after he'd been assistant head coach for a few years prior to that. He's had great success coaching the cornerbacks during that period. He's also been a very successful recruiter on the defensive side of the ball. He knows the program inside and out. He knows the players. He had a stellar career as a player himself at Penn State. He's done a very nice job since being an pressed into service after Franklin was fired. Now, yes, he in fact may know by now that he isn't the top choice but that's not the same thing as your assertion that he knows he's not up to the job.

2) I don't disagree with your observations about Sitake. It's not that I think he'd be a bad choice and certainly if he got the job, I'd be pulling for him 100%. My point was that there were a lot of guys on Kraft's list before Sitake, who really wasn't on the radar screen at all before a week ago, and after they all dropped off, suddenly Sitake became the flavor of the day. File that under making a virtue of necessity. In any case, it seems pretty clear that Kraft is making a run at Sitake. It also seems pretty clear that BYU and in particular one of its big donors are determined to keep Sitake in Provo. I guess we'll how all this plays out but after all this, if we whiff on Sitake, it will not look good.

3) That quote of mine that you cited simply points out some painful facts. OK, calling the program "imploded" may be an overstatement but not by much. The rest is on target and it's not hyperventilating to recognize this.

4) I agree in part. We aren't privy to Kraft's thinking and we don't have the inside scoop. I'd like to think they have somebody locked down but the available indicators do not point in that direction. Meanwhile, if you notice, pretty much all the various P-4 programs that fired coaches recently wasted little time in naming replacements...because the longer a job search goes on, the more uncertainty and instability are created. As it is, we lost another committed recruit today and if I'm not mistaken are now down to five remaining for the 2026 class, which 247Sports currently ranks 130 in the nation. This is what I meant when I talked about stopping the bleeding. But maybe Sitake will bring half his team with him a la Curt Cignetti.

5) I totally agree with you about Hartline. We brought in one Buckeye coaching hot shot and it hasn't worked out quite as well as everyone predicted.
 
Frank Lee said:
"...the head coach oversees all of these divisions of labor. Sure, they have a Chief of Staff, a Head of Operations, etc. But they need the experience to make sure that these are all working effectively and seamlessly."

Org charts and responsibilities can be changed unless there's an NCAA regulation on it. Paradigm shift, out of the box thinking, etc. The head coach, especially if Terry, should be relieved of all responsibilities that don't pertain to assembling and training players, and winning football games. Maybe there should be a CEO who is independent but supportive of the SVP - Game Operations (aka Head Coach).
***
Henry Ford stuck to building simple cars using efficient processes. Years later, Michael Dell did the same thing but in a different industry. Many Ivy MBA CEOs with those aggressive CEO personalities want to know what their companies are doing in the cloud space, AI, data analytics, product financialization, leveraging balance sheets, IPOs, stock buy backs, etc. IMO, they should focus on building quality products and services that the market wants at the prices it's willing to pay. Moral of the story: K.I.S.S.
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It's not the craziest idea I've heard. But again, Terry has never even been a coordinator. I don't see him being ready even on the football only aspects.
 
The Spin Meister said:
His title included ‘assistant head coach’ so you have no idea how much knowledge and experience he has at managing the empire.

He didn’t get that title for good looks. And he wasn’t given the title to keep him from leaving.

He got it because he earned it. And he had to get managerial experience with that title.
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He got that title to enable the BOT to approve his raise. That's when the title was added. I seriously doubt it significantly changed his everyday responsibilities.
 
Jerry said:
1) I think you're selling Terry short. He's had very wide experience in the program which is why they gave him the title associate head coach several years ago after he'd been assistant head coach for a few years prior to that. He's had great success coaching the cornerbacks during that period. He's also been a very successful recruiter on the defensive side of the ball. He knows the program inside and out. He knows the players. He had a stellar career as a player himself at Penn State. He's done a very nice job since being an pressed into service after Franklin was fired. Now, yes, he in fact may know by now that he isn't the top choice but that's not the same thing as your assertion that he knows he's not up to the job.

2) I don't disagree with your observations about Sitake. It's not that I think he'd be a bad choice and certainly if he got the job, I'd be pulling for him 100%. My point was that there were a lot of guys on Kraft's list before Sitake, who really wasn't on the radar screen at all before a week ago, and after they all dropped off, suddenly Sitake became the flavor of the day. File that under making a virtue of necessity. In any case, it seems pretty clear that Kraft is making a run at Sitake. It also seems pretty clear that BYU and in particular one of its big donors are determined to keep Sitake in Provo. I guess we'll how all this plays out but after all this, if we whiff on Sitake, it will not look good.

3) That quote of mine that you cited simply points out some painful facts. OK, calling the program "imploded" may be an overstatement but not by much. The rest is on target and it's not hyperventilating to recognize this.

4) I agree in part. We aren't privy to Kraft's thinking and we don't have the inside scoop. I'd like to think they have somebody locked down but the available indicators do not point in that direction. Meanwhile, if you notice, pretty much all the various P-4 programs that fired coaches recently wasted little time in naming replacements...because the longer a job search goes on, the more uncertainty and instability are created. As it is, we lost another committed recruit today and if I'm not mistaken are now down to five remaining for the 2026 class, which 247Sports currently ranks 130 in the nation. This is what I meant when I talked about stopping the bleeding. But maybe Sitake will bring half his team with him a la Curt Cignetti.

5) I totally agree with you about Hartline. We brought in one Buckeye coaching hot shot and it hasn't worked out quite as well as everyone predicted.
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1) I don't think so. To my knowledge there has never been a position coach at any top power 4 school elevated all the way to head coach in the history of the sport. It is IMO completely naive to think that someone can jump multiple levels like that at a top program and be successful. It would be setting Terry and PSU up to fail IMHO. AND I LOVE TERRY! I love the way he stepped up and refocused our players when there was a lot of selfishness tearing things apart. I think he will be offered a job at PSU for life with a very nice increase in pay. It just won't be the head job. It isn't fair to Terry, PSU, or anyone. It's too much to realistically ask.

2) It could be Sitake or not. I think is absolutely qualified and has a track record of success with much fewer resources. But I'm not married to any candidate and I don't think we should be until it is announced. Alot of what gets pushed in the media is total crap and simply not true.

3) When you lead with imploded, it's going to sound like hyperventilating. That's all I was pointing out by saying to breath.

4) I'm not going to twist myself to every which way a new internet or media rumor blows. They'll announce a hire and I'll 100% back that new coach.

5) Yeah, some actually think Knowles is a plant. He may just be terribly over-rated. But I don't want Hartline for character issues.
 
To break the Sexton lock, then it needs to be proven that head coach pedigree and/or experience aren't as responsible for success as some believe.
Load data in a spreadsheet with data such as coaches name, program, early W-L records to recent W-L records, longevity at a program, longevity as HC, program size, resources, conference, records without said coach, recruiting class rank, etc. Then run some correlation analysis.
In that way, we can see things like former OSU assistant Luke Fickell's achievements at OSU, UC, and UWM. Likewise for Ryan Day, Chip Kelly, Steve Sarkisian, Dabo Sweeney, Lane Kiffin, etc. Is it the person, program, position, resources, conference, etc.

I read a journal article looking into whether Harvard MBAs make more effective CEOs. Controls were company size, industry, previous stakeholder value, pertinent CEO background info, and so forth. The methodology was pretty clean. The findings were that an MBA, or one from Harvard, had little to no effect on company performance.

Maybe Terry, with some tweaks to program structure and personnel, could show that much of a coach's success is related to environmental factors.
 
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Frank Lee said:
To break the Sexton lock, then it needs to be proven that head coach pedigree and/or experience aren't as responsible for success as some believe.
Load data in a spreadsheet with data such as coaches name, program, early W-L records to recent W-L records, longevity at a program, longevity as HC, program size, resources, conference, records without said coach, etc. Then run some correlation analysis.
In that way, we can see things like former OSU assistant Luke Fickell's achievements at OSU, UC, and UWM. Likewise for Ryan Day, Chip Kelly, Steve Sarkisian, Dabo Sweeney, Lane Kiffin, etc. Is it the person, program, position, resources, conference, etc.

I read a journal article looking into whether Harvard MBAs make more effective CEOs. Controls were company size, industry, previous stakeholder value, pertinent CEO background info, and so forth. The methodology was pretty clean. The findings were that an MBA, or one from Harvard, had little to no effect on company performance.

Maybe Terry, with some tweaks to program structure and personnel, could show that much of a coach's success is related to environmental factors.
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I worked for a sports agency (one of the largest) for 6 years, I can tell you data don't lie. Sometimes it can be distorted if you are not comparing apples to apples (like Fickell, did great with OSU players). That being said, I know you are all into finding just a great coach, but they must be an even better recruiter, they need the players (again, see Fickell). It's all the things you mentioned, but resources equal players. And if you disagree with that equation, X equals players (fill in what the variable or variables X is).
 
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